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Author Topic: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD  (Read 2647 times)

miyzfrider

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HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« on: April 09, 2011, 12:05:42 PM »

Greetings!  Just purchased a DM10 studio kit and have learned lots from this forum already.  Thanks for all the great topics and help I've already received.

I am having trouble getting my HH controller to map or control Addictive Drums (Demo) properly.  I am using it through FLStudio (Full Registered Version) and simply am connected via the USB port on the DM10 to my laptop.  Everything is fine, and I can play with the demo of AD without any trouble on the kick, snare and crash.  However the Hi Hat controller doesn't seem to show a different MIDI value when open or closed.  By that I mean that when the pedal is open and I hit the hat, AD registers it as Key 46.  When I close the pedal and hit the hat, I see it stay as Key 46.  When I close the pedal, I hear a closing sample, and I get the Key of 44.  If I "chick" the pedal I get a Key of 30.  So there is differences, however as I said there is no difference when the pedal is open or closed when hitting the hat. 

In the DM10 itself, if I simply play on it alone, everything works fine.  So it appears to be a MIDI issue exclusively. 

I'm baffled.  I was wondering if the AD demo is limited and that is the cause however FLStudio is also showing no difference in the MIDI signal mapping between the open and closed hat.  So I tend to think it's something within the DM10 or the way the USB Windows interface is seeing things.  Given that the pedal does register as far as the closing sample and the "chick" sample, I'm confused. 

Thanks for any help all.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2011, 12:37:08 PM by miyzfrider »
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vaikl

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2011, 01:28:26 PM »

miyzfrider, welcome to the forum!

The different open/close sounds are typically triggered by so called CC values, not direct MIDI notes. The standard controller number for this is 4.

If you are using a proper MIDI map for the DM10 and take a look into the MIDI map window of AD (under the BEATS tab, in the lower right corner; there you can also select your MIDI map), then you have many possibilities to tweak your hihat trigger and sounds.
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2011, 01:37:18 PM »

Thanks for the response.  I've done that, and even used one of your maps for the DM10 Studio that you posted a while back.  I found the thread where you posted those.  Still no joy.  I've also gone into the DM10 to ensure that "Note + CC#4" is set under "Utility>Trigger" menu, which it is.

After reading more I see that there won't be a different MIDI note for open and closed triggering.  But the CC functionality doesn't appear to work.  Not sure if it's related to the demo version of AD?   ???
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2011, 03:09:11 PM »

I decided to purchase Addictive Drums so I can see if it's related to the demo version.  I figured it will work one way or another, and I wanted AD anyway.  As a bonus, Musician's Friend has it on sale right now for $99. 

So I'll get the download installed and post back if it works. 

Lars
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vaikl

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2011, 05:08:27 PM »

I decided to purchase Addictive Drums so I can see if it's related to the demo version.  I figured it will work one way or another, and I wanted AD anyway.  As a bonus, Musician's Friend has it on sale right now for $99. 

So I'll get the download installed and post back if it works. 

Lars

Good decision, but you could additionally check if FL is transporting CC values on the port which the DM10 is assigned to. I don't own it but have heard that FL doesn't open all ports for CCs automatically.
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stongej2002

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2011, 06:05:45 PM »

One thing I had to do with AD is make sure the CC offset is checked. For the Hi Hat and move the foot close sensitivity way up. That might help you. I know it helped for me.
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Alesis DM10 Studio /w pearl mesh heads, Alesis Trigger I/O, Mapex Falcon double pedal, Roc N Soc throne, Vic Firth sticks, Superior Drummer 2.0, Metal Foundry expansion, Sonar 1x Studio

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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2011, 07:51:55 PM »

Good decision, but you could additionally check if FL is transporting CC values on the port which the DM10 is assigned to. I don't own it but have heard that FL doesn't open all ports for CCs automatically.

Well, I think that is the issue.  I discovered that it appears the CC values aren't being translated which must be a FLStudio issue.  When I went into the DM10 and switched it to "Note Only" in Utility>Trigger menu, I was able to assign an open and closed sample using the learn ability within AD.  The CC functions just don't seem to work, which I guess may be the reason that AD doesn't list FLStudio as a support DAW program.  I bought that many years ago, so maybe I'll have to pick up a different program.  If I get a new USB audio interface, I'll probably get an LE version of something anyway.

I'm awaiting the registration code for AD so once I get a full version, maybe I'll get lucky. 

Thanks again for the responses guys.  I'll post back once I get the full version going. 
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2011, 09:48:32 PM »

Well, after trying a few other VST plugin hosts, I've definitely determined it is an issue with FLStudio.  So at this point, I'll need to use something different. 

At least the mystery is solved.  Thanks again for offering some ideas.  Off to spend more $$.   :(
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Tsints

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2011, 12:14:02 PM »

Sorry for the late reply, I just read your post.
I've tried Addictive Drums, Superior Drummer and BFD with FL Studio... the hihat sound remains open. It's definitely an issue with FL Studio, in Cubase everything works great.
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2011, 12:26:12 PM »

Sorry for the late reply, I just read your post.
I've tried Addictive Drums, Superior Drummer and BFD with FL Studio... the hihat sound remains open. It's definitely an issue with FL Studio, in Cubase everything works great.

That's unfortunately what I discovered too.  I downloaded Reaper and am giving it a go.  At $40 I'm going to go that route I think.  Just trying it for now with their 30 day trial.  I don't use FLStudio a lot anyway and can always create in it and use it as a VST plugin in Reaper.  Outside of FLStudio, the HH controller works just fine.  Oh well. Thanks for confirming that for me.
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inconn

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2011, 12:41:44 PM »

Hey guys, is the problem still there in FLstudio 10?
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2011, 12:52:47 PM »

Hey guys, is the problem still there in FLstudio 10?

FLStudio 10 is what I'm using.  Just downloaded it two days ago.  Yes, I can confirm it doesn't appear to map the MIDI CC keys for the HH controller properly. 
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inconn

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2011, 11:15:24 AM »

:-/

That's what I'm using. So is there no workaround?
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #13 on: April 15, 2011, 12:13:25 PM »

The only work around I found was to go to the Utility>Trigger menu in the DM10 and select "Note Only" instead of "Note+CC".  Then in AD you can select an open HH and closed HH sound by learning them.  That at least gives you a definite open and closed sound properly.  However, you won't have anything in between like the CC functionality gives.

What I'm doing is purchasing Reaper which is a DAW for around $40 if you're using it personally.  Then you can use FLStudio as a VST plugin if you have that need.  It's not ideal, and hopefully at some point FL will incorporate the CC standard into their MIDI control, but for now it's the route I'm taking.

Hope that helps!

Lars
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inconn

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #14 on: April 15, 2011, 01:14:37 PM »

Yes, I found that workaround too.
The sad thing is - my alesis module kits are almost the same - I'm having a hard time getting the half-open hihat sounds. Its like the pad, or the curve works this way:

20% Closed
15% Semi open
75% fully open

I tried numerous trim options and curve setting and nothing seems to work reliably :-/
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miyzfrider

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Re: HH Open and Close Not Working Correctly from DM10 to AD
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2011, 01:00:54 AM »

Yes, there are no doubt some issues with all of that, especially noticable if you are used to playing on acoustic drums as I am.  But, for the purposes intended and for what I wanted them for in the first place, I can live with it. 

I'm not home and won't be till next week.  When I do I'll post back my settings for the HH.  I find they work pretty good, at least the best I could make them work. 
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